Our guest this week is a musician whose work travels through both genre and space.
He’s currently the bandleader for The Late Show with Stephen Colbert and we all enjoyed the scoring he had a hand in creating for Disney’s Soul.
On Episode 021 of The MICK Show, we get into all of his current work, including his recently-released album WE ARE, and how his New Orleans roots lead him to the award-winning work he makes today.
We also talk about his inspirations, and how he’s been staying creative this past year.
You can follow Mick (@mick) and Jon Batiste (@jonbatiste) on Instagram.
New episodes of “The MICK Show” (presented in partnership with @maximmag) are released every Wednesday!
MICK: All right, welcome back to The MICK Show. This week we have a very special guest, one of the most prolific musicians around in my opinion, and it’s funny because my last name is Batyske, but people always for years have pronounced it Batiste, and so for many years, we’ve had a pseudo same last name for people who don’t know, and so we have Jon Batiste here today. And I’m excited to have you here, man. Thank you for being on The MICK Show.
Jon Batiste: Man, thank you for having me.
MICK: Lot of stuff I want to talk to you in this little, short time period. Let’s start with the most important things first. You have an amazing album that’s out right now called We Are.
Batiste: Man, let’s get it.
MICK: And let’s talk about that. As I listen to the album, I am struck by how perfect you were able to make it sound retro and modern at the exact same time. You can hear organs and then you hear 808s, and it’s just… It’s such a cool combination of that. Can you tell me a little bit about your mindset going into that?
Batiste: So, when you listen to James Brown, or when you listen to Nina Simone, or when you listen to Prince, or anybody that has really influenced a sound in music, it only sounds like them. The greatest artists all create their own synthesis of everything that they like and that makes them who they are. And I love so much music, I love so many different things, that to create the genre of Jon Batiste and synthesize all of that into an album was really my mindset, and really the thing that made me excited about doing it.
MICK: It’s funny you say Prince, because when I listen to I Need You, and you do kind of more of like that spoken word, pseudo kind of rapping flow on it, it reminds me of when Prince would kind of pseudo rap on his songs. And nobody called it really rapping at the time, but it was like the tone of how you were doing it, and it was like a lower tone voice. It just totally reminded me of when he would just break down into that, and people would be like, “Damn, is Prince rapping? Nah, Prince ain’t rapping. What is he… He’s just talking, but it’s rhyming. What’s going on?” And I just… I thought you kind of really killed it on that song.
Batiste: Oh, thank you, man. I like to think about making music like painting, and if you’re a painter, you use specific colors for certain things, and you can’t replace that. Like if you need a red, you can’t use blue. And you can’t even use orange. You gotta have the certain type of red. And if you’re blending paints, then it is even more specific. When I think about cadences of voice, and rhythms, and chords, and thinking of all the different sonic frequencies that you can put together to create a song, there’s a lot involved in that. And that cadence of on I Need You, that kind of rap kind of thing that you’re hearing, that’s just the color that was necessary to get the point across.
I don’t even think about it in terms of singing, or rapping, or anything like that. It’s just it’s like painting.
MICK: Right. It’s interesting. I taught myself how to DJ when I was 18, but before that, I played drums and I played piano, so I felt like I learned rhythm from drums and I learned finger dexterity from piano, and that kind of made me a really good DJ, because those are the two things you need the most. So, when I DJ, I don’t think about it just as a song I’m playing. I think about it like if I’m scratching, it’s like my body is recreating a piano, and if I’m cutting records back and forth, in my mental state I’m recreating drums. And then I don’t know if you’ve seen it yet, but the new Biggie documentary that came out on Netflix recently, but what’s fascinating is, and the thing I think that’ll really resonate, Biggie’s neighbor growing up was a famous jazz musician who was actually, while all the stuff was going on with him selling crack one block one way, he was playing him Max Roach and all these people one block the other way, and nobody knew that until this movie just came out. And they did this whole crazy thing where they overlayed like Max Roach drum fills with Biggie rapping some of his most complex couplets, and you could actually hear how he was influenced by that to stay in pocket, and nobody knew that. All 30, 40 years, nobody had any idea about that.
When you just said how people do music in colors, and in pocket, I think that’s… It’s pretty fascinating when artists do that.
Batiste: Man, it’s funny you mention that. So, back in the ‘80s in jazz, there was a movement called the Young Lions movement. And this movement was basically led by musicians from New Orleans who moved to New York City. Wynton Marsalis, Branford Marsalis, Terence Blanchard, and Donald Harrison Jr. was a part of that. He’s the saxophonist in the Biggie doc that you’re talking about.
MICK: Yeah. Yeah. You’re right, you’re right.
Batiste: Donald Harrison Jr. is from New Orleans and he taught me when I was a teenager, and my very first album, Times in New Orleans, he’s playing saxophone on my first album.
MICK: Wow.
Batiste: So, he was my mentor when I was 14 years old. I moved from New Orleans when I was 17. 16, 17 years old. I graduated high school early, and I moved to New York City. And he played on my album just before I left New Orleans and we still keep in touch. He’s still somebody who I consider to be a mentor and a friend. So, I didn’t see the documentary, but I know very, very well what you’re talking about.
MICK: That’s amazing. I mean, I feel like that guy should be like A&R to the stars. He’s two for two.
Batiste: Man, look. He’s incredible because he’s somebody who always created something that was his own, even within what we call the genre of jazz. This is something that he had his own approach to. It’s just the idea of taking everything that you love and understanding it through the tapestry of who you are and not through the narrow prism of a genre.
MICK: I like that. What’s something you listened to growing up that… Is there something you listened to growing up that people would be surprised that you listened to?
Batiste: I love punk music, but I don’t think a lot of people… I mean, I have a track on this record that kind of taps into the sort of punk, video game, jazz intersection. It’s called Whatchutalkinbout, but I mean I’ve always loved punk music. When NERD came out, I really thought that was a revelation, because I was listening to punk music before they started doing that, and I was like, “Somebody should just come out and take these elements and blend it with other things.” Since it’s happened in different ways, but it still has a lot of left that you could do with that, and avant-garde music I really love. That’s the kind of music where people aren’t playing discernible melodies or harmonies. We call it free jazz sometimes. It’s basically experimental music.
I love experimental music. I love punk music. I love things that stretches the bounds of what is considered music to the point where you almost don’t know if it’s a song, or it’s performance art, or it’s sound design. I get a lot of inspiration from that.
MICK: I’m so glad you mentioned Whatchutalkinbout, because that is tied with Cry for being my two favorite songs on the album, and when I hear Whatchutalkinbout it’s nuts, because I hear the NERD inspiration, and I also hear like this 2021 version of André 3000 coming out through the music. I was like, “Gotta do a remix with him or something on it.” Like the way you’re flowing on that is incredible. I think it’s gonna blow people’s minds when they really internalize what you’re doing on that song. Were you inspired by… I assume probably growing up in the South, too, you were inspired by Outkast at some point?
Batiste: Man, it’s so funny you say André, because that’s who people hear in the track, and I know André as a friend, but you gotta understand, when I was growing up, late, late ‘90s… Well, really early 2000s, the thing that you couldn’t avoid was the Hot Boys, and Master P, No Limit. So, if you’re from New Orleans, you didn’t listen to anything other than that, and I almost didn’t really get into other stuff until around ’03, ’04. That’s like a neo soul movement. You got Mos Def, you got Common, then you got New York, like The Blueprint with Jay-Z. So, like it’s funny you mentioned André, because I got into André when I was in college. Obviously, that’s around the time of The Love Below and Speakerboxxx. But just going back, it was mostly Hot Boys.
MICK: Every time I’ve ever DJed in New Orleans, like especially pre-digital, when you had to actually still show up with records and stuff like that, I’d be like… There was records, I’ve heard them, but there was no way I was ever gonna get those records, and I would have to call people like, “Hey, man. I just need to borrow three. Any three that you know are gonna set this off.” Because there was just no way where I grew up I was ever gonna have those records, because you’re right, it’s its own world. It’s its own musical universe down there and it’s amazing.
Batiste: Man, Mystikal, Soulja Slim, DJ Jubilee, Big Freedia, 5th Ward Weebie, that’s what I was listening to. This like… This is local stuff. We only are on our own vibe. That was the way it was.
MICK: Let me ask you one last question on this. Have you ever been sampled by anybody? Because I was trying to find somebody that sampled you and I looked on WhoSampled and I didn’t see anything, but as I listen to this new album, I’m thinking man, if I’m a producer, there’s a lot of shit in here that people could really work with. It’s incredible.
Batiste: Man, that’s funny. I don’t think I've ever been sampled officially. I’m mostly in the studio playing stuff. If people wanted to sample it, this album will probably be one of the best in my catalog, because there’s so many different things… Man, I play 12 instruments on this record. You know, I play 12 instruments, I’m singing obviously, but there’s so much range of sound. It’s a good record to sample.
MICK: It is. There’s a lot of really interesting interviews now in the last couple years with Bob James, who got screwed on all his publishing for the first 20 years, when he was the most sampled person in hip hop history, but now they got it all right, and he was like, “Man, I love this shit.” Like, “What? Mardi Gras? What?” It is interesting, though, because like the people who play the instruments that are actually sampled barely get the money, but you know, that’s a question for another podcast.
Let’s talk about Soul. How did that happen?
Batiste: I was in the real early stages of the project talking about the story and for two years, really just being on the team. They were starting this project even before that. My name came up to them from multiple sources when they were telling people they wanted to create this film that had this main character who’s a pianist, and it’s jazz based, and it’s about the origin of the soul, and all of these different things kind of tying together and having this score that was multifaceted. They were trying to figure out how to put together a team of composers that could accomplish all of it and bring a unique, kind of innovative collaboration to the project, and Trent Reznor and Atticus Ross name came up and my name started coming up a lot, and they put us together, and that’s really how it transpired. You know, Trent and Atticus obviously have been in the film world for the last decade, and they were just really thinking about Joe, the main character, and it feels like I was born to be in this film in that way. It’s just so many things that lined up for it to really make perfect sense for me to take on. And the rest is history.
MICK: I love that. And I just love how the true artistry and the true music stuff really shines through that, because if you would ever think that a guy who made Nine Inch Nails records called Head Like a Hole in like ’91, and then a guy who’s on TV every night, could merge together, like what it would sound like, and then when you hear it, it’s just like it’s literally a perfect synergy of just true music. Do you have any more movie things coming up?
Batiste: Oh, yeah, man. I have some stuff coming up. I actually can’t talk about a lot of it, but it’s exciting. Really something that I’ve always wanted to do, and this is just the way things work, man. You have ideas and you think, “Well, I’ll get to that in five years,” but then the right opportunity comes along, next thing you know, Oscar nominated. It’s like the train is gone. Let’s go.
MICK: Yeah. Have you found that the pandemic has helped you get more done because stuff slowed down a little bit? Or how has it impacted your creativity?
Batiste: I think it’s actually helped my creativity. I’ve really had time to take stock of what I don’t want to go back to and the things that are important to me, simply because we’re all isolated and we’re trapped inside. We have time to think about everything in our life. And at first, it’s difficult, because you gotta get used to a new normal, and you can’t really go to the places that give you inspiration, you can’t see the people who you give… who you want to give love to, and family members, and friends who inspire you, and that kind of funnels into creation. For me, a lot of the time, that is inspiring for me, I couldn’t do that. But then I realized, man, this is a time that we will never have again. This is… Besides the loss and the tragedy of it, which I’ve had my fair share of that, as we all have in this time, it’s also a time where the world has actually stopped. That will never happen again, I imagine, for the rest of our lives.
MICK: How has it been doing your TV obligations during quarantine? And has it been a challenge? Did you guys… I assume when the world really started coming back, it just totally changed your workflow of something you’re used to doing every day, day in, day out.
Batiste: Yeah. It really did change everything. We do music now remotely. The band is all remote. My appearances are from home, which in general feels very different to what it’s been for the last five-and-a-half years before that in front of a studio audience at the Ed Sullivan theater. So, I don’t really anticipate us going back until at least the end of the summer, if not much later than that, and I’ve gotten used to it.
MICK: I feel like everyone’s gonna be like we’re all so excited to go back and do things that once we get out there, we’re just gonna be like, “Man, my couch was so comfy.”
Batiste: It’s gonna be like that for sure. We’re gonna miss this time. Not that we’re gonna miss the difficulty of it, but we’re gonna miss the aspect of it that allowed us to be at home, and to deal with our thoughts.
MICK: For sure. If you could have a dream dinner party, or a dream wine tasting, or dream whatever, with like five of your favorite musicians of all time, no genre specific at all, who would they be?
Batiste: Wow. I’d pick Yoko Shimomura, Duke Ellington, Michael Jackson from the Jackson 5 era. I would put my man, Claude Debussy. Seemed like he would be a talker. And man, one more. Oh, just one more. Kanye.
MICK: Ooh. The six-billion-dollar man, Kanye West. I really hope if you ever get to have that hologram dinner party with some of those people, you record it. I think it would go quickly from your dinner party to his dinner party. Very, very, very quick. But I am glad that you said a rapper in there. I thought you were gonna say like… I thought you were gonna go local and go Mia X, or like B.G.
Batiste: The thing about it is I’d be interested in seeing the interactions. What is Duke Ellington gonna say to Kanye and vice versa?
MICK: Right.
Batiste: And Claude Debussy, he wrote a lot of reviews in his time. He was very opinionated. I was thinking about people who I love, but also people who are opinionated in different degrees.
MICK: You know, of all the times I’ve asked this question, this is the most well thought out, even though it was off the top, answer anybody’s ever given. That just shows how deep into music, that it just goes so far that you could answer on that analytical level. I love it. Before we get out of here, man, is there anything else you have coming up this year you’d like to plug or talk about?
Batiste: Man. Wow. This year is crazy because everything shifted. You know, I had a symphony that I was gonna premier this year that will premier next year at Carnegie Hall in May. It’s called the American Symphony. It’s four movements, 40-minutes long, over 200 musicians. That’s a huge piece. And then I’m just working on a musical for Broadway with the family of Jean-Michel Basquiat.
MICK: Wow. That’s amazing. I mean, I can’t even… I would assume they probably have all… That stage setup would be incredible if it’s like all Basquiat art.
Batiste: Man. Come on, man. We got access to all of this art obviously from the family and the estate, and I’m just very, very pleased with the fact that this… It’s something that we’re moving forward with. Because there hasn’t been something that the family and the estate has sanctioned the artwork to be used for in any sort of historical retelling of Basquiat ever, so it’s gonna be a really definitive piece.
MICK: I love that. Cool, man. Well, you know, I don’t want to hold you too much. I know you have the amazing release of this album going on right now and we appreciate you so much for being on The MICK Show, and you know, make sure you guys go out and stream, or buy the vinyl of We Are. It’s available right now. It’s incredible. Doesn’t matter what genre of music you like, there’s literally something for everybody on there, and it’s just… It’s a flawless piece of work. So, we thank you so much, Jon, for being here.
Batiste: Yes, indeed. Thank you, my brother. Let’s get another gig together.
MICK: As soon as the world opens up. For sure. All right. Thank you, man.
Batiste: Later on.
MICK: That was it for another episode of The MICK Show. Thank you so much for tuning in. Please rate and subscribe to The MICK Show wherever you like to listen and make sure to follow on Instagram @Mick and on Twitter @iamMICK. Let me know who you want to hear on a future episode, and we will see you back here next week.
The MICK Show is presented in partnership with Maxim. The show is produced by Lantigua Williams & Co. Jen Chien is our editor. Cedric Wilson is our producer and mixed this episode. Manuela Bedoya is our social media editor.